Are you worried about Croatia qualifying for Euro 2020?

free counters

How do you identify yourself and why?

December 22, 2015

slide_10

 

This question is particularly interesting to me because my answer depends on my location. If I am in the states, I identify myself as Croatian. If I am in Croatia, I identify myself as Dalmatinac. If I am in Sibenik-Krapanj-Brodarica, I identify myself as Amerikanac.

 

I was born and raised in the United States to Croatian born parents. This should make me American right? Yes, I am American, however, I feel that I eat, think, act, speak, love, and play like a Dalmatinac. So I identify myself as Croatian around the world because most people don’t have a clue where Dalmatia is. Now, in my parents region, most people look at me as an American because I live there and spend most of my time there. However, they can relate to me as Croatian or Dalmatian because of who I am.

 

Now the tricky part is answering am I first Croatian or first Dalmatian? I spoke to a Sicilian a while back and he stressed how he’s Sicilian and not Italian. Completely discounting the country where he was born. I spoke to someone from Zadar a while back and he answered as Dalmatian first and Croatian second.

 

Tell us how do you identify yourself and why?

 

Share




Denis Svirčić
Posted By: Denis Svirčić 181 comments





  1. Poglavnik says:

    Depends who I’m talking to and if I feel like going into detail or not.
    My family are Hercegovci from as far back as we can trace it.
    Which makes me a proud Canadian born HERCEGOVAAAAAAC!!!



  2. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    Lets try to keep religion and politics out of it. Not to say its not important(for me its more important than nationality, ethnicity, etc etc), just taking it out of the equation.

    @Poglavnik,

    So you identify yourself as Hercegovac first, Croatian second?

    @Cekic,

    I am trying to keep religion and politics out of the equation. Again, not saying that its not important, just asking what region/culture/race etc do you identify with.



  3. Poglavnik says:

    @Denis
    I do to Hrvati and to people who understand the region.
    Iv run into so many people (as have most here probably) that don’t even know what Croatia is.
    To those people I don’t waste my time describing Hercegovina and it’s borders and it’s people.
    Fact is when I’m in the villages of my family I feel more Croatian than I do when I’m within the actual borders of Croatia.



  4. Cekic says:

    Fair enough, I identify myself as Croatian.

    Anyone who answers Dalmatian first and Croatian second is a one dumb son of a bitch.



  5. Sude Mi says:

    I’m Canadian of Croatian descent.

    I go by this because I was born, raised and educated in Canada – continue to live in Canada. I do not pay taxes, own property in Croatia.

    I love my ethnicity and the fact since both my parents are Croatian Catholics that direct lineage is strong and consistent.

    When in Croatia I always say I’m from Canada…..I find people refer to me as Amerikanci less so than when it was Juga, then you could say Canada ten times and they would not acknowledge it which pissed me off no end.

    Generally speaking when I am in CRO and speak Croatian most people have a really hard time saying where my dialect is from….my dad is from Lika, mom from Medjimurje grew up amongst a mixed bag from all over in Southern Ontario so it is no wonder no one can tell! LOL



  6. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    I guess that I’m “one dumb son of a bitch.”

    The best way that I can describe it is that “Dalmatian” is my tribe. This is no disrespect to Croatia or the USA. At the same time, my “tribe” and lets say “hercegovac” tribe are not miles apart but inches apart culturally. Where as the “Catalan” and “spaniard” tribes are different.

    Again, I am just throwing this out there to make conversation. This wasn’t meant to divide us but to educate us.



  7. Cekic says:

    Gaelic is a language, and the Irish wolfhound speaks the same language as the Irish Water Spaniel and it doesn’t matter where they’re born they’re always Irish.



  8. Slavonac from Canada says:

    first, you are Croatian and then you can be from Dalmacija, it can’t work the other way around unless you are more loyal to dalmatia and go as she goes…whether its to the Italians or martians…those that first and foremost pledge allegiance to dalmacija or anywhere else first, have identity issues and should be considered like we consider those fucked up French separatists, losers!

    there’s many stories about the war in Croatia and I think I mentioned the Serb neighbor (next door to my sisters house) that took arms and fought for Velika Srbija…well, a few doors over from him there’s another Serb family…that family took arms and fought for Croatia and Croatians. they could have easily gone the other way…heck, most Croatians towns and villages had little to no weapons but these people did everything to fight for Croatia. ask him what he is…he’ll tell you he’s a Croatian of Serb descent and that he’s proud of what Croatia has given his family…yup…even ol farmland Slavonija!

    my point in all this is that most dalmatinci love to distinguish themselves…they’ve got some pride…the dalmatian sea and overallm scenery and it makes them better than someone from inland. I’ve heard it all my life from my friends MOSTLY those from Zadar/ Biograd na Moru and Split…kinda makes me happy I’m a Slavonac…where people are more humble and kind rather than someone that thinks Croatia is dalmacija just because they boast a beautiful sealine and they are entitled to the title because when people visit, they visit the tourist spots on the beach!



  9. PakyCroat says:

    Aussie Croat here, but I’m intrigued about where the authors family is from, you say Šibenik Krapanj brodarica region…… My family is from Krapanj, don’t hear that mentioned much by other croats apart from my family…..



  10. Cekic says:

    What do you guys believe is more important, the good of the whole (Croatia) or the good of a part (Dalmacija or any other part), the way you answer this question will tell you what you consider yourself first?
    I believe Denis is Croatian first, but he just doesn’t know it!
    Can you imagine a Dalmatian saying, “I care more for the good of Dalmacija than I do for Croatia?” Dalmacija aren’t going to Euro 2016, Croatia is!



  11. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    I am asking how do you feel. I lived in the states for 34 years but I don’t “feel” 100% american.

    @Slavonac from Canada,

    “those that first and foremost pledge allegiance to dalmacija or anywhere else first, have identity issues”

    Maybe I have identity issues, who knows.

    As far as “pledging allegiance” I don’t think that is an issue unless dalmacija or another region, group, tribe, whatever wanted to break free from Croatia.

    What if Dalmacija went to war with Croatia, broke free and gained its independence. Would a person be a Croatian living in Dalmacija? For some yes, for others no.

    As far as “allegiance” I think I’ve done my share for Croatia.

    I’m talking about how someone feels inside about themselves.

    Francesco Totti calls himself a Roman. Dude isn’t shitting on Italy he just feels more Roman than Italian.

    @anonymous,

    “What do you guys believe is more important, the good of the whole (Croatia) or the good of a part (Dalmacija or any other part), the way you answer this question will tell you what you consider yourself first?”

    Interesting question.

    I don’t see it as more important or less important.

    I mean some people in Zagreb would rather see Dinamo Zagreb win champions league then Croatia to win the world cup. Same with Splicani with Hajduk. Anyone out there feel the same?

    “most dalmatinci love to distinguish themselves”

    I agree. Most dalmatinci do and for stupid reasons like “the dalmatian sea and overall scenery and it makes them better than someone from inland.”

    I’m not trying to divide Croatians or come across as if a Dalmatian is better than the rest of Croatia. In most cases, Dalmatians are rude, grumpy, impatient, unfriendly and arrogant people. I’ve had a much better experience elsewhere and heard great things about Slavonia.

    @PakyCroat,

    My parents were born on Krapanj. Shoot me an email: denis@croatiansports.com



  12. Brodjan says:

    Southside Chicago Croatian
    Slavonac
    Brodjan
    In that order.
    Usually that covers it all and leaves no questions needed.



  13. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    “I mean some people in Zagreb would rather see Dinamo Zagreb win champions league then Croatia to win the world cup. Same with Splicani with Hajduk. Anyone out there feel the same?”
    If Croatia win a World Cup the WHOLE country rejoices!

    WHOLE country rejoicing or a part of country?



  14. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    I dont see it as a competition or an “allegiance”. I see it as how a person feels about himself.

    That would be like me saying, “I feel like I am more like my dad.” That doesnt mean that I have more allegiance towards my father vs. my mother.

    Overall, an interesting debate. No right or wrong answer in my opinion.

    I overheard this old Croatian ustasa supporter living here in the states say: “There are no more Croatians living in Croatia. They are all abroad.”

    What would happen if Dalmacija split from Croatia? The Dalmatians that were saying “I am dalmatian first, Croatian second” would bash on the ones that didn’t.



  15. Soul Champ says:

    New York Hrvat

    Mother is ethnic Hrvatica born in Fiume, first language is Italian, spoke Croatian to her maternal grandmother. Likes when we communicate in Italian, but I feel svi Italijani su pederi.

    Father from Zadar, has land on the coast of the beautiful Northern Adriatic.

    I often wonder if the Jadransko more was not so exquisite would I feel such a connection to Croatia.

    Clarity –

    In New York I am Croatian and in Croatia I am a New Yorker.

    @ Slavonac

    I spent many a summer with refugees from Vukovar in Rijeka. Best people of Croatia hands down.

    I love Dalmacija but the Dalmatinci (minus my family of course!) can keep it moving.



  16. Faux Cro says:

    @Denis:

    I don’t feel 100% American either although I have only been to a Croatia a handful of times.

    When in Croatia, it just feels natural, like I should be there.



  17. Slavonac from Canada says:

    Denis, were you taught you’re a dalmatinac and therefore you feel it’s engrained in you? there is something real special about living in Slavonija, believe me. The hospitality, generosity and overall helpfulness of your everyday neighbor is something you have to experience to appreciate BUT…as we saw in Vukovar…the love of being that piece of the puzzle in a greater picture…ie…Hrvatska…is far greater than that piece we call Slavonija!

    We are just as proud Denis, but we are also proud of the amazing differences and alikeness throughout all parts of Croatia. I love my customs…for weddings, Christmas, a gathering or some particular event but I love your customs as well, that’s why we are the same and different…but not unique…mi smo svi Hrvati!



  18. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    “That would be like me saying, “I feel like I am more like my dad.” That doesnt mean that I have more allegiance towards my father vs. my mother.”

    Because you love your whole family not just a part of your family, and what applies to the family applies to the whole nation. Your allegiance is with your WHOLE family/nation.
    You’re Croatian first like I said.



  19. Bolan Ne Seri says:

    Some of the topics on this site….why don’t you just ask who here will go fight if Croatia goes to war again?



  20. Pepes mom says:

    Ziva has stated his answer as “Basement dwelling Amerikanac” and something about calling Modric a bust,but I told him that second part cant rank as a nationality.Boy,I dont know this Ziva well,but he is not good in the head.



  21. Cekic says:

    @Bolan Ne Seri
    Like Chesterton said, “There’s no such thing on earth as an uninteresting subject; the only thing that can exist is an uniterested person.”
    Bolan Ne Seri, you might want to ask yourself, what the fuck are you doing here, if the topics aren’t to your liking?

    If Croatia goes to war will you go fight?



  22. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    I reckon Bolan Ne Seri is one of the regular posters who hasn’t got the balls to post under his regular name.
    Any chance you can find out?



  23. Ziva Istina Ziva Istina says:

    Get it straight…..fortified basement dwelling diaspora hrvat.

    Shit, this topic is better than the regular “hey let’s discuss the starting XI for the repka three months before the next qualifier”. This is welcomed.



  24. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    I had an interesting discussion with a friend of mine born in the states to Croatian immigrants from Novalja. When I first asked him the question he replied “Hrvat”. Then after the discussion he showed me his tattoo of Novalja and changed his answer to Novalja.

    Again, I’m not here to divide Croatians. I wish that our people are like jews when it comes to helping one another and sticking together. Sadly, we don’t come close.

    @Slavonac from Canada,

    “were you taught you’re a dalmatinac and therefore you feel it’s engrained in you”

    Not really. My parents aren’t hard core Dalmatinci or hard core Croatians. They stressed religion a lot more.

    “there is something real special about living in Slavonija, believe me. The hospitality, generosity and overall helpfulness of your everyday neighbor is something you have to experience to appreciate BUT…as we saw in Vukovar…the love of being that piece of the puzzle in a greater picture…ie…Hrvatska…is far greater than that piece we call Slavonija!”

    I’ve never been to that region but heard so much from friends that have visited. Slavonija is on top of my list for Croatian destinations.

    “mi smo svi Hrvati!”

    Yes, but of course. Mi smo braca svi.

    I don’t root for players from Dalmacija over players from Zagreb. We are all Croatians.

    @Cekic,

    Just cause I identify myself as Dalmatian doesn’t mean that I dont have allegiance for Croatia.

    How do you feel about Totti saying that he’s Roman and not Italian?

    How do you feel about most Sicilians saying that they are Sicilian first and Italian second?

    How would you feel about mormans in Utah saying that they are Utah first, USA second?

    @Bolan ne seri,

    “why don’t you just ask who here will go fight if Croatia goes to war again?”

    interesting question.



  25. Bobby V says:

    54 year old Chicago Croatian (father born on Osljak – an island off the coast of Zadar, mother born near Mostar)

    Father escaped in 1953 by rowing across the Adriatic with 4 other guys to San Bennedetto del Tronto – stayed there in a refugee camp for 3 years.

    Mother was picked up by a Catholic orphanage group from a small town near Mostar in 1943 (after a massacre killed all the men there) and brought to Austria where she lived for 8 years.

    Both made it to Chicago and met there in 1959.

    The second way I identify myself? – as a blogger for Croatian Sports Report, of course – haha



  26. Idemo says:

    When speaking to an American or non Balkan person, I tell them I am Croatian, because I legally and technically am.
    You tell tell them you’re Hercegovac they automatically call you Bosnian or from BIH which I am not, when I’m in Croatia or Mostar or wherever I tell them the city I am from and from that they should know I am a Catholic hercegovac with Croatian citizenship



  27. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    You joking around?
    “Just cause I identify myself as Dalmatian doesn’t mean that I dont have allegiance for Croatia.”

    I understood your comment, just cause you’re more like your dad (Dalmacija) doesn’t mean you have more allegiance to your dad vs your mother (Croatia). But yet you said you’re Dalmatian first!

    Uniting CROATIAN fans around the world!



  28. Cekic says:

    By Roman does Totti mean the capital city Rome or the Roman Empire? Because some Italians think the Roman Empire was Italy!



  29. Smocito says:

    I definitely identify as Croatian when asked. I was born in Slavonski Brod to a family from Komiža on Vis and Biševo. I am now a naturalized US citizen working in the US until I retire in Croatia.



  30. Naprid Bili says:

    “Your country ain’t your blood. Remember that.”
    Hrvat (born & living in the U.S.).
    Dalmatinac by region.

    Region should not make a difference, whether you’re from Zagreb, Istra, Slavonija, Dalmacija, Hercegovina, Bosna, or Sandzak.

    A lot of you guys are blowing this “dalmatian separatism” out of proportion. I’ve never heard this from Dalmatinci in Dalmacija, ever. Though it would be nice to return the Croatian capital back to Dalmacija.

    As for Croatian regional separatism, take a look at Istra and Rijeka.



  31. Naprid Bili says:

    and by the quote i mean diaspora croats don’t need to idenitfy by the country they live in. You’re a Croat whether you were born/live in Asia, South America, Africa, or mainland Croatia…



  32. Naprid Bili says:

    quote taken from the Godfather when Sonny tells Vito why he shouldn’t involve himself with the U.S.



  33. ARMADA87 ARMADA87 says:

    Here in the states:

    Croat first
    Istrijan/Kvarnerac second

    In Croatia:

    New Yorker – even though I moved out of the state



  34. ARMADA87 ARMADA87 says:

    To each their own, but I’m not a fan of folks who claim region before domovina.

    Have a lot of those in my family. Istrijani in general are big on that but I think its rubbish. Our people (Hrvati – in case that was not clear) have fought for hundreds of years to get us a sovereign state where all regions are under the same border and we are ruled by Hrvati (slightly debatable with guys like Milanovic as the premijer) and some people aren’t proud of that and can only claim their region?!

    Starcevic, Krajl Tomislav, Jelacic, Radic, etc. just took had a collective roll-over in their graves.



  35. Horvat says:

    I’m Croatian Canadian.

    Yesterday (on the same day this was posted) I applied for Croatian citizenship for my children and I.



  36. Ziva Istina Ziva Istina says:

    Some interesting replies.

    I was always raised as a “hrvat”. Never any mention or discussion of being from a certain region.



  37. Joe says:

    I’m an American who married a Croatian from Zagreb. My wife and son go back every Christmas for 2 months to reconnect with the culture and family.
    However I have always wondered what my son would identify as. My wife identifies 100% as a Croatian in a city with a very small population of Croats. She calls my son a Cromer I can here and back in Zagreb.

    I just know my wife’s culture and heritage is important to her. So it is important to me that my son grows in it. So I enjoyed reading some of these responses…

    Also. Wheels up for Zagreb in 4 hours…

    Sretan Božić I Sretna nova godina



  38. Slavonac from Canada says:

    Regional differences are what make us as Croatians, beautiful! I love Zadar and I love almost everything about it from how it looks to how people talk and the food….I also like the differences between Zadar and Slavonija, I find that is part of why we as Croats are all strong and for each other… We respect one another and embrace the differences!



  39. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Armada,

    “and some people aren’t proud of that and can only claim their region?!”

    I don’t think anyone isnt proud of that.

    @Cekic,

    Yes, uniting Croatians Around the World. Am I dividing by my comments?

    I’m not sure on totti about Roman.

    The parents example was just an example. Not my parents.

    @Slavonac,

    I agree.

    @Joe,

    Thanks for sharing. Sretan Bozic i Nova Godina!

    @Naprid bili,

    “As for Croatian regional separatism, take a look at Istra and Rijeka.”

    I can’t speak for Istrani considering themselves Italian. You have to walk in their shoes.

    @Smocito,

    Yes



  40. ARMADA87 ARMADA87 says:

    @ Naprid Bili

    There are no separatist movements going on in Istra or Rijeka. The Italian population amounts to nothing in that region currently. If anything you have WAY more Bosanci/Albanci/Srbi in that area compared to Taljani.

    The only thing Istrarska zupanija would eventually like is to become an autonomous region, like nearby Friuli-Venezia Giulia in Italy so they could have more say in how they rule themselves, where money goes, etc.

    because nothing pisses off Istrijani more than having a bunch of purgeri in ZG telling them how to govern. What am I saying though… there are no purgeri in ZG, really just getting told what to do by a bunch of backwards hercegovici…



  41. the realJP says:

    @Denis, great question and good discussion here.

    In case any of you’d like some research on the subject, see here: – http://dcthomasphd.com/node/21

    Identity is an interesting thing, and is not set in stone, it can and does change.

    Sretan bozic i nova godina svima!



  42. Maminjo says:

    @Armada

    Ironically, the autonomous movement in Istra is being headed by a guys whose background is Bosnian Croat. He’s like a 2nd generation Istrijanac at best.

    But you’re right about the non-Italian factor in Istra. There is maybe only Italians in Rovinj, but even then, it’s like 15% of the population. They’re not the ones calling for autonomy.

    People in the diaspora have never been to Istra, nor are there many Istrijanci in the diaspora to educate them. So the assumption is that Istra is just filled with separtist Italians (which is not true at all). Most don’t even know that Rijeka is not Istra.



  43. Bolan Ne Seri says:

    Denis- you’re obviously not dividing. Nothing wrong with new topics to discuss when it’s slow. But when you’ve got people on this forum like Cekic, there obviously isn’t enough intelligence for a normal discussion. That’s why I asked my sarcastic follow up question. To which Cekic showed how dense his head really is.



  44. ARMADA87 ARMADA87 says:

    @ Maminjo

    Tocno… People just hear the stories from baba and dida about Istra and the Kvarner from the WWII era. Things have changed. Roving, Porec, Umag, Pula all have tiny Italian populations at this point. My bigger beef is all these Albanians and Bosnian Muslims coming into the region.

    There aren’t a lot of us Istrijanci, you’re right. We have pockets of in NYC, NJ, Cleveland, CA and some scattered around Canada.

    If Tony M. aka Ziva Istina truly is from Cleveland, he’s run into a Istrijanac or two in his day.



  45. ZG/TO says:

    Timely question about personal identity given the possibility that our next PM may be a diaspora Croat. I suspect Orešković wouldn’t call himself anything other than Croat in spite of his time in Southern Ontario. For the record, I feel the same way. I certainly have a strong allegiance to Canada but I only think of myself as Croat whether I’m in Canada or Croatia.



  46. ARMADA87 ARMADA87 says:

    just going to post about that…

    next premjier will be a Canadian-Croat purger with some shady pharma dealings – curious to see how this turns out



  47. Bolan Ne Seri says:

    Nothing wrong with bringing up new topics Denis, however your question is so good that I’m not going to answer it! Me and my fellow douche bags do this a lot, we will write a comment and when we get called out by someone we say we were joking or being sarcastic (I feel intellegent when I do this). As for being a regular poster who hasn’t got the balls to post under his regular name, Cekic is right on that one.



  48. Elvis says:

    @Poglavnik

    No but there are Trans-Croatians. These are people who have nothing to do with Croatia but feel Croatian. It’s a strange condition that I think some here suffer from.



  49. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    I don’t give a shit if it was your parents or an example, your point was made.

    Do you have more allegiance for Dalmatia vs Croatia?
    Remember your example!



  50. idemo says:

    “When someone identifies themselves as a hercegovac or a dalmatinac, I pray for them.”

    mrs u picku materinu dubre jedno, BUDI PONOSAN



  51. Slavonac from Canada says:

    Denis,the best way to express our feelings toward our region/town/selo

    Sve postivam, svoje uzivam!!!



  52. Croatianperson85 says:

    Born and raised in Canada so I am Canadian.

    Both of my parents are Croatian, born in Croatia and came to Canada in there 20’s.

    Father – Zadar/Dalmacija. Mother – Pula/Istra. I read a lot and try an educate myself on the history of Croatia, it’s different regions etc.

    I can understand why there would be more/less support from some people to consider themselves Dalmatinac/Hercegovac etc first before Croatian. There is a lot of history in Croatia; different historic cultures, invaders, foreign influence wars, geographic lines being redrawn every so often. Illyria, Panonia, Romans, Greeks to an extent, Austrian, German, French, Italian the list goes on…

    When you mix so much together it’s only natural that some people are going to identify as one thing over the other.

    I personally am not a fan of identifying myself as a Dalmatinac/Istrianac before Croatian which is why I don’t. I can speak, read and write in Croatian and visit Croatia frequently. I personally call myself Canadian/Croatian.

    To get technical, I am a 1st generation Canadian of Croatian descent.

    I think this is an interesting question you brought up Denis. Many people whose parents are immigrants (at least in Toronto and surrounding parts) say they are from this or that country even though they have never been there, speak, read, write in that language or maintain there culture/heritage through celebrating certain events/functions or cuisine.

    Technically if your parents are from somewhere, whether you like it or not, I would think you are still of that culture/ethnicity to a varying degree.

    Question here for everyone is HOW Croatian are you lol? Is it entirely personal? Can that even be measured lol? or does someone need to know some of there history, read, speak, eat the food, celebrate specific events etc to consider themselves Croatian OR can someone not do any of that and still say they are Croatian? Thoughts?

    I think there will always be criticism for those who say they are Croatian but don’t know anything about the country and feel they are Croatian because they drink a Croatian beer wearing a Croatian jersey eating cevapi and love the sound of the music even though they don’t understand the lyrics. I think it’s personal with each individual. Would that even bug anyone here if people considered themselves Croatian and were proud of being Croatian even though they may not be fully involved with the above mentioned ideas? Is there anything wrong with that?

    Going back to the initial question, I think it’s your preference. In Croatia – I am a Dalmatinac/Istrianac. In Dalmacija – I am from Zadar/Pula. In Istra – I am from Zadar/Pula (based on where my parents are from) but above all else, I am a Hrvat from Canada OR a 1st generation Canadian of Croatian descent which I am proud of.

    I became more proud of being Canadian as I got older because personally, I think if you live in a country your whole life, are born there and it gave your parents an opportunity to come here and earn a living to help raise a family than you should consider yourself part of that country at least somewhat. You can be proud of where your parents are from and still be both. It’s up to you decide how involved in your community and culture you want to be and what you want to call yourself.

    I am saying this because I think Canada has an identity issue somewhat. Children of immigrants say they are from somewhere else while they are born, living, working and educated in Canada and would never live in there parents country other than visit IF that. I find that somewhat parasitic.
    There needs to be a certain level of recognition. Everyone has there own opinion on the U.S but I think Canada needs to take a page from the Americans maybe even the Aussies when it comes to national pride. Just my opinion. I just can’t imagine living somewhere my entire life and not considering myself part of that country. I think that’s partially why zidovi get ragged on a lot. An abuse of nepotism and being tribal has potential to create backlash from people. There is a certain balance for being proud of your where your parents are from but also recognizing where you are now.

    There is no rule book on how you are supposed to feel however I think identifying yourself by your region in Croatia before Croatia itself has the potential to foster a separatist mentality. To me it is weird considering how much the country has gone though to fight for independence for me to now say I am from Dalmacija first before Croatia.

    Once again, personal preference in my opinion. No right or wrong answers. To each there own.

    Sorry for the long message everyone although you don’t have to read it either.

    Sretan Bozic I Nova godina! Bog I Hrvati!

    Balkanization, or Balkanisation, is a geopolitical term, originally used to describe the process of fragmentation or division of a region or state into smaller regions or states that are often hostile or uncooperative with one another.
    Balkanization – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balkanization



  53. Croatianperson85 says:

    BTW – I forgot to mention – When in Croatia – I am a Dalmatinac/Istrianac (where my parents are from) who is from Canada.

    Some of the locals, cousins of mine would joke with me when we spoke about this exact topic saying that regardless of how proud you are, how well your Croatian is, if you know every song and the lyrics, the politics, etc you are still born and raised in Canada making you a Canadian also.

    How receptive the locals are towards you comes down to how you behave when you are there. Many of my diaspora cousins on vacation would go to the beach in Nike Air Max’s, baseball hats, some hip hop song blasting and decked out like they were at some local pool in North America treating local Croatians like they would on vacation in the Domincan Republic and that pissed off a lot of locals. I personally would wear flip flops (sometimes bear foot just to get away from everything) bring a towel (sometimes not even that and just dry off in the sun) and shorts. Not because I was trying hard but because I consider myself a minimalist for certain things. That’s just who I am and I know the locals were more receptive with the under the radar behaviour vs behaving like I am in Toronto while in Croatia.

    That was just the selo’s opinion in Dalmacija where my father is from on any Croatian diaspora.



  54. Ziva Istina Ziva Istina says:

    This all depends on how you were raised. If you were brought up learning the language and culture then you are more inclined to identify first as a hrvat and then second as a Canadian/American.



  55. dannyj says:

    odd that this topic starts at Christmas time

    I was born and raised in Canada, raised up with Croatian values and to love both countries. many of our parents left croatia for whatever reason and managed to work hard and have a good life free of oppression in the western world wherever that may be. be thankful we were able to enjoy the freedoms which our adoptive countries gave us yet able to keep our own culture.
    always be thankful for that. i can’t stand the croats that when i was growing up saying this and this about canada…. yet are using the system so effectively… disgusting

    anyways i will leave you with a nice verse from the bible… while some of you don’t believe or just believe what was fed to you… stop the hate my friends. especially in this special time of the year

    Sretan Bozic to all and your families… may their be peace on earth.

    1 Corinthians 1:10 ESV

    I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.



  56. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @TherealJP,

    Oh course we get the best answer from a PHD graduate.

    “Identity is an interesting thing, and is not set in stone, it can and does change.”

    Line of the year.

    My dad’s uncle is proof of this. Born and raised just outside of Sibenik. Escaped communist Yugo, by hiding in a lifeboat across the atlantic ocean in the early 40s at the age of 23 or so. Dude was in Normandy during WWII with the american flag on his shirt. The last 20 years of his life I remember him saying that he’s American. “This country is so great because we are united. The united states.” He watched baseball for 50 years. Dude identifies himself as American.



  57. Cekic says:

    Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all Roman Catholic and Ustasa loving Croats.

    To all you traitors, turn coats, apostates and condemners of your own ancestors, because I am an all round nice guy, Happy Holidays.



  58. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Smocito,

    nice. shoot me an email.

    @Slavonac,

    “Sve postivam, svoje uzivam!!!”

    Yes, but uzivam i u Istru, u dubrovniku, u Zagrebu.

    @Croatianperson85,

    Wow! What a comment. Feel free to post any time my friend. This was like a well thought out essay with a thesis, paragraphs to support your point and conclusion. At the same time, it was an interesting read.

    @dannyj,

    “be thankful we were able to enjoy the freedoms which our adoptive countries gave us yet able to keep our own culture.
    always be thankful for that. i can’t stand the croats that when i was growing up saying this and this about canada…. yet are using the system so effectively… disgusting”

    yes, yes, yes! I agree.

    “I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.”

    Yes, not here to divide.



  59. Cekic says:

    I am a Lican, Denis is a Dalmatinac.
    Now to anyone who can help me out here, what is it that unites us?
    Remember Denis is a Dalmatinac first (but he doesn’t know if he has identity issues!) and I am Croatian first.



  60. Cekic says:

    @the realJP

    My identity is set in stone and will never change.
    Your comment was however addressed to Denis, are you implying that Denis might not identify himself the same way today as he did yesterday?



  61. Cekic says:

    @the realJP
    So if someone says, I forget who said it, “I know who I am, what I am and where I’m from. I’m proud of who I am, what I am and where I’m from,” what would you say to this man?
    Lets give this MAN a name, we’ll call him Josip!



  62. Slavonac from Canada says:

    Denis, you know that feeling…when you just arrive and smell the town/village…it’s a distinct smell. You walk a few hundred meters and the same greet you today as they did 25 years ago. The communal feeling you get…you know your place, you demonstrate the respect and they open their heart and door for you. Ti mozes uzivat na plazi, u klubu ili izmedju prijatelje, al nije to to…Ono kad uzivas I priznas da si kuci!!!

    I have been to some of the nicest places in the US but I love coming home. That’s the way I feel about my village in Slavonija…you can give me the riva, the pijaca, the more or any hot spot throughout Zagreb, Split, Vodice, Primosten….and none compare to my village, tamo uzivam tko nigdje drugo…because it’s where my roots a re from and still are! I walk where my grandparent and great grandparents before them did, we have traditions that no other part of Croatia has…

    I hope you’re lucky enough to get the real feel of Slavonija! It’s not so pretty but the people make it a place to remember!



  63. Tiha Vala says:

    Croatian. Born in Cro, immigrated to America as a child. Was blessed that my parents only spoke Croatian to me and sacrificed a lot to make sure I made it back for a significant amount of time every year.



  64. Ante B. says:

    Americki purger hrvatskog podrijetla lickih korijena. Sin desnicara i zagrebackih fakina sa zagrebackog asfalta. Dinamovac i katolik.



  65. Jarac says:

    haha gotta love this topic

    All in all diaspora croats huge basket cases, identity crisis. Now I can see why this is parents raised (atleast if they are typcial diaspora) as croats, catholic, and if u burp or farted they said that da si nekulturan amerikanac.

    Here is how I solved the problem. Its ok to be happy with both my friends, (unlike your parents who are unhappy) you don’t have to pick one over the other. I am proud to be croatian-american period. And if your not proud of the american or canadian or australian or whereever the hell you are, then get the fuck out.

    Now for what I tell people. In america I am croatian american, in croatia I’m croatian who lives in america.

    Now for the whole regional beef, come on guys we all know the only people who consider there region to be seperate (and above all) the sacred dubrovcani ;)



  66. Jarac says:

    Sorry in america I say I’m croatian the american parts implied cause I sound like an amerikanac, so I dont need to say american.



  67. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    “Remember Denis is a Dalmatinac first (but he doesn’t know if he has identity issues!) and I am Croatian first.”

    I guess that makes us enemies now.

    “My identity is set in stone and will never change.”

    I disagree. What if you move to Peru tomorrow, live there 40 years, almost forget the Croatian language, and never go back. Now you identify yourself as Peruvian. I wouldn’t object.

    @Slavonac,

    I get what you are saying now. Slavonija one day my friend.

    @Jarac,

    I married a Dubrovcanka. I need to start asking some of her people some questions. :)



  68. Cekic says:

    If I move to Peru tomorrow, I move with the knowledge I have now.
    You make your comment as a person who doesn’t know if he has identity issues.
    I don’t have that problem, I’m a Roman Catholic, Ustasa loving Croatian. If you know me better than I know myself, please tell me which of those things you see changing?



  69. MelbCro says:

    Nothing wrong with regional pride but always Croatian identity comes first. Not sure how it is in North America but in the Croatian community in Australia this can be a touchy subject. More often than not if someone identifies aggressively as a Dalmatinac first it means they are a Yugo. A lot of the people who self identified themselves as Yugoslavs pre 1991, switched over to calling themselves Dalmatinici (people from korcula are usually the worst offenders). The Yugo clubs became Dalmatian clubs etc. Same goes for in New Zealand as well where these individuals identify as and are know by the mainstream society as Dallies of all things.



  70. Ziva Istina Ziva Istina says:

    Tsk, tsk……………..those people you mentioned surely did not grow up living a “za dom….spremni” lifestyle. Curious as to how they are handled down under: ignored, insulted or frowned upon. Or they just don’t know any better?



  71. Livno1981 says:

    this is such a simple answer:

    Croatian-Canadian

    Always Croatian first, and when asked from where in Croatia, I say Bosna. When they say where in Bosna, I say Livno, and just keep drilling down.

    If I ever said I was Bosnian, my pokojni Mama and Tata would have beaten me. Croatian first, always.

    Herceg-Bosna is Croatian land!!!!!



  72. Ab says:

    Melbcro makes a good comment. I noticed the same Jugo nostalgia with the ones who prefer to stress the region over Croatia. Real shame.



  73. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    I happen to watch this on TV the other day. Interesting take on Croatians, Yugos, udba in the US in the 70s.

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x20v020_the-fbi-files-s06e16-radical-resistance_shortfilms

    @Jarac,

    Tell me about it. haha. Na, I couldn’t be happier with her. So far haha.

    @Cekic,

    A little touchy aren’t we?

    You missunderstood me. My fault the way I worded it.

    ““My identity is set in stone and will never change.”

    Your identity might be set in stone the rest of your life. All the power to you.

    “I disagree. What if you move to Peru tomorrow, live there 40 years, almost forget the Croatian language, and never go back. Now you identify yourself as Peruvian. I wouldn’t object.”

    When I wrote “you” I wasn’t referring to “you”. I should have wrote “someone” instead.

    @Melbcro,

    “More often than not if someone identifies aggressively as a Dalmatinac first it means they are a Yugo.”

    I hope I’m not an “aggressive” one. You do make a good point. In San Pedro, we had a Yugo club turn into a Dalmatian Club as well. I’m not sure on the demographics in other cities, but the Croatians in San Pedro are 95% dalmatinci.



  74. AB says:

    “You do make a good point in San Pedro we had a yugo club turn into a Dalmatian club”. Too funny and sad at the same time. Makes you shake your head.



  75. Jm says:

    At denis
    Dangerous talk. Cro already so small, why divide further?. Perhaps we change the title to dalmatiansports.com

    I identify as Catholic first
    Then. Croatian and American. One can love both mother and father



  76. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @JM,

    It shouldnt be “dangerous talk.” I don’t see a “divide.” Those Dalmatians that put themselves above other Croatians are dividing.

    “Perhaps we change the title to dalmatiansports.com”

    The past few years its been “hajduksoccerreport.com.”

    I agree with you on “Catholic first.” That is how I was raised.

    At the same time, for some people that is not set in stone. How many Catholics convert to born again christians and jehova witness?



  77. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    “fist, you are Croatian and then you can be from Dalmacija, it can’t work the other way around unless you are more loyal to dalmatia and go as she goes…” – Slavonac from Canada

    More often than not if someone identifies aggressively as a Dalmatinac first it means they are a Yugo. – Melb Cro

    The conclusion I come to when I read these comments is that someone who identifies themselves as Dalmatinac first never needed a Croatia! You would’ve been a Dalmatinac first even in Yugoslavia. But like you said, that doesn’t mean you would’ve had more allegiance for Dalmacija vs Yugoslavia.



  78. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    I think the key word there is “aggressive.” I know some of those people who feel that way about Dalmacija and I frown upon that because it is dividing.

    At the same time, I feel that we are comparing apples and oranges. I’m not choosing one over the other. I am stating how I feel culturally.



  79. Cekic says:

    It’s the not KNOWING that makes something not set in stone.
    When you KNOW you KNOW, if you change later that just proves you didn’t KNOW!

    @Denis
    Do you see a time when you might identify yourself as Croatian first, which I already believe you are?

    Watch the Joe Simunic interview again, he KNOWS!



  80. Cekic says:

    My Catholic faith is set in stone, because I know that it’s the One True Faith, and I will never believe lies!

    My identity is set in stone.

    Denis I would like to end this now.



  81. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    Be careful with “When you know you know.” Someone might think they “know” at 30, then realize at 50 that they didn’t “know”.

    I have a lot of Croatian and American in me. I just “feel” that I am most Dalmatian. What is the ratio? Who knows.

    I know people that are born in dalmatia that have no feeling for dalmatia. They don’t have much of a dalmatian culture. I bet that they dont identify themselves as Dalmatian first.

    Anyways, I agree with you on another thing “I would like to end this now.”

    Great debate my friend. Hopefully, we will meet one day and talk it over a couple of beers or dalmatian(just kidding) wine.



  82. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    It is also possible that you might know something but not even know that you know it!
    You Denis are Croatian first, you just don’t know it yet!
    On the flip side, you might think you know but you don’t know!

    An example,

    Luke 23:34
    And Jesus said: Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do. But they, dividing his garments, cast lots.

    They thought they knew!

    Merry Christmas.

    Please Denis don’t reply to my comment, I’m one of those idiots who always has to have the last say.



  83. Poglavnik says:

    Is it even possible to be a a true Roman Catholic and an Ustasa lover?..
    I agree with a person’s identity changing as their mind develops.
    I’m much more of a critical thinker now in my late thirties than I was in my early 20’s.
    People are not the same in their 20’s, 30’s, 40’s ect.
    I was even a religious boy at one time, and who knows maybe my faith will return to me one day.
    That would be some confessional and a lot of Zdravo Marijo’s!



  84. Cekic says:

    For it is better not to know than to go astray; but to know is better than not to know. Therefore, before all things, we ought to strive to know.
    – Saint Augustine

    You went astray Poglavnik because you didn’t know.

    I on the other hand know, therefore I will not go astray (my Faith is set in stone). It’s not my identity that will change, the only change that will happen with me is eventually I will know more!



  85. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Denis

    Coming from the same neck of the woods as you do, Sibenik, I must say I identify myself as Croatian in the states, and not Dalmatian.

    I go back every Summer to return to my Plebeian roots, and I travel extensively throughout that region. And Dalmatia itself is a diverse land composed of different peoples and dialects. This is why I see myself as more of a Šibenčanin than Dalmatian.

    As we all know, Dalmatia has historically been a valuable piece of real estate, with foreign invaders trying to get a piece of the action for centuries. So there’s been various influences on the region.

    Plus ya got Northern Dalmatia (Zadar Region), Middle Dalmatia (Sibenik Region), and Southern Dalmatia (Split Region). To top it all off, within each region you have:

    The Highlanders, honest hardworking folk from the Selos of the Hinterlands, then ya got Coastal people who are somewhat stuck up and look down upon the Highlanders as “Vlaji.” Then finally there are the Islanders, they speak “čakavski” as opposed to folk on mainland Dalmatia who speak “Ikavski.”

    Dalmatia itself has so many natural barriers that it wasn’t easy to make it from one Selo to another! Therefore you had different dialects and cultures develop. It was only in the last few decades, when the roads were paved, bus/ferry service established, faster boats, that people within Dalmatia began to intermingle more. This why other regions of Croatia are more homogenous. I know we’ve been discussing different regions on this thread. I just though I give a “Micro” input on Dalmatia.



  86. the realJP says:

    @cekic

    It changes principally because you add new elements to it.

    You can’t undo the past, but you do gain new experience as you do stuff (enter a new profession for example), and so some of these new experiences have bearing on your existing identity as you move along.

    Reality is such that the only way that your identity doesn’t change to some extent, is if you do nothing new.



  87. Poglavnik says:

    @Anonymous
    For it is better not to know than to go astray; but to know is better than not to know. Therefore, before all things, we ought to strive to know.
    – Saint Augustine

    Huh?…
    That is as contradictory a statement as I’ve read in a long time.



  88. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik
    Going astray is worse than not knowing.
    Why have you strayed from the Catholic faith? Because you didn’t know. You would’ve been better off not knowing and not going astray, but you went astray because you didn’t know. That’s why it’s better to know, so you don’t go astray.



  89. Poglavnik says:

    So ignorance is bliss?
    Unless you knew and chose to go astray then you didn’t really “know” all along.
    Whatever dude.
    Those stories never made sense to me even as a ten year old.
    Try reading something else for a change.
    Maybe a science book or two.



  90. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik
    You remind me of Steven in Nacho Libre, he only believed in science and hated all the orphans in the whole world, that’s why they never won any of their matches. But in the end Steven changed and didn’t hate all the orphans in the whole world. Maybe one day you change back, who knows?

    Is ignorance bliss? No use for me to answer that, you won’t understand it because you don’t believe. You only believe in science.



  91. Poglavnik says:

    Well i haven’t written off the chance of me evolving both mentally and spiritually so you never know.
    I find more comfort in concrete knowledge.
    Great movie by the way!
    Sretan Bozic.
    Now don’t you be late for misa!
    I’ll be at home with Krampus…



  92. Cekic says:

    @the realJP
    You can always add new skills and knowledge, but my identity still doesn’t change.

    If I start a new profession I would need the skills and knowledge before entering my new profession, the only thing that changes is I would be working with new people, and I fail to see how that would change my identity.

    If I learn something new about the Catholic faith, something new is added, but I’m still Catholic.

    I’m Ustasa loving, remember those Nazi’s, Facists and butchers of the Balkans, after reading all the bad stuff surrounding the Ustase and to still call myself Ustasa loving, that ain’t changing.

    And I’m Croatian, that in my opinion can’t change.



  93. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Croatia vs. Antwerp,

    Whats up with Sibencani? They sound as if they want to break away from Dalmacija. Split screwed them over something, now a good chunk of Sibencani root for Dinamo. Zadar and Sibenik were equal economically 30 years ago or so. Now, Sibencani are pissed at them for something.

    You do make some good points as far as different parts of dalmacija, inland vs islanders etc. etc.



  94. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Denis

    Ya hit the nail right on the head! A lot of Sibencani do root for Dinamo–and I’m among ‘em.

    I remember years back seeing Hajduk came into town to play Sibenik. Now Subicevac is a small modest stadium, but the place was packed. The atmosphere electric. And everyone showed up! The Mayor, the Mailman, the Funcuti, even my extended family, even my Tata (Dida woulda made it but he was already sick by then). And there was not a PEEP from Torcida! Heck, even the Police were on our side as they were all local folk. Now who’d a thought a buncha SELJACI would put Torcida in their place??!!!!

    Anyway getting to your point on why the Sibencani are pissed at Split and Zadar. Well it all goes a way back, lemme explain…

    You see Sibenik was an industrial town, which was the heart of the Dalmatian “Rust Belt.” Kinda like a Cleveland or Detroit in the States. For decades, factories such as Crnica and Ražine employed many. Two generations of my family worked in those factories. The work was tough. And if you didn’t work in the factories, you worked in the fields, etching out a living as a farmer.

    Now with Split and Zadar, their economies were always more diversified, relying on Transport, Shipping, some Industrial, but they also had established Colleges and Universities (Sibenik does not). So they were able to create more white-collar jobs for their population.

    When the War came along in the 90s. Industrial production plummeted, and Sibenik in particular was hit pretty hard. Split and Zadar, with their diversified economies were better able to weather the storm. They also had a stronger lobby and were able to get more help from the central government after the War. This is why there is an animosity towards those two towns.

    So unlike Zadar and Split, Sibenik never fully recovered from the War. They shut down Crnica, and now they are in the process of shutting down Ražine. So it hasn’t been easy. But in the last few years there has been a push to turn things around. They’re fixing up the Kalelarga (the town’s main medieval street), renovations are being made to Sveti Jakov–the architectural jewel of Dalmatia. They opened up shopping centers Dalmare and Plodine, providing jobs to local folk. They developed a luxury Marina in Mandalina, for Mega-yachts, employing a good amount of people.

    But with Blue Collar jobs lacking, people are really trying to make do with what they got. Some People like on my Mom’s side of the family, who are proudly Highlander, are working the fields producing grapes and olive oil. My Cousins even had to get licensed for this (EU requirements ya know).

    All in all, it hasn’t been easy, but I think things are slowly turning for the better in the Sibenik region.



  95. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Croatia vs. Antwerp,

    Thanks for the explanation. I knew some of this from before but you took it to another level.

    Both my grandfathers worked at Ražine.

    Dalmare and Plodine are nice, but I dont want to see Dalmacija turn into a big shopping mall. Everything is catered to the tourists out there.

    They should focus on industry all over Croatia. Here in so cal, I’ve worked at so many small machine shops that produce all kinds of parts for the military, aerospace, aircraft, etc etc. Millions of dollars year after year.

    I’ve heard people say: “How come croatia doesn’t produce a car?” Why not start with these machine shops before we compete with BMW and Mercedes.

    So you sound like a pretty hardcore Sibencanin. Thats great! My aunt married a dude from Kaprije and have lived in Sibenik since the mid 80s. Their kids, my cousins, are city folk compared to the rest of my family out there in krapanj-Brodarica.



  96. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Denis

    My Great-Grandfather was stationed in Crnica. But my Grandfather and Uncle worked in Ražine. Heck, our Grandfathers prolly knew each other from working in the same plant! I just hope they change their minds about Ražine. In it’s heyday, Ražine was to Sibenik, what GM was to Detriot.

    It’s good they actually put up Dalmare and Plodine, as you know, it was built on that empty stretch of land between between Brodarica and the town center (so it’s not in anyone’s backyard.) The place is packed during the tourist season, people who are renting apartments from costal towns have a place to shop for supplies and food. This is a great benefit to the local economy.

    Dalmacija won’t turn into a big shopping mall. They’re pretty strict when it comes to zoning, carefully designating land for commercial, agricultural, residential uses etc.

    I agree Croatia should focus on producing ancillary industrial parts, stuff they can ship up to Northern Europe for final assembly. Large industry/assemblages would require substantial capital investment, so they should just stick to parts in the beginning.



  97. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    I’m 41 and I was born and raised In Canada. I consider myself Canadian with Croatian Blood in my veins. My parents are from Karlovac and Zagreb.

    Regional Pride is good as long as it never supersedes the country as a whole. I was in the Canadian Infantry for 10 years. We had soldiers from British Columbia to Newfoundland. We all boosted about the areas we came from ie Ontario was better then Alberta and if two people were from the same province then it got even more detailed. I’m from the Greater Toronto Area thus that would trump someone from Ottawa. This was all in good fun because we all knew that we were representing Canada, fighting for the same team. When shit was real it didn’t matter what region you were from.

    I also would never pretend to be a true Hrvat since I don’t live there or pay any taxes.I don’t think being a die hard Repka fan counts for anything. Only those who have lived all there lives in Hrvatska can have the honor of being truly Croatian anyone else who believes they’re on the same level are truly fooling themselves.

    Dont get me wrong pride in your heritage is a good thing. It establishes a person identity and roots. We all have a passion to belong and man who feels no connection is already dead.

    Lastly my Tata who is a true Hrvat. You know the one that wouldn’t let the Serbs conscript him into the Yugo army. The man who would never say he was wasn’t Croatian. That guy who had to escape twice to get to Italy while being shot at.The one who couldn’t visit his Homeland for 50 years because he would be immediately arrested. Ya that guy said it best.

    When I was kid I was confused between being Canadian and Croatian. I loved Hockey and Soccer but felt torn. My parents had a funny accent and I did not. So one day I said to my Tata. If Canada goes to war with Croatia who do I fight for. My Tata replied. That’s easy you were born in Canada so you must represent your homeland. I will fight for Hrvatska since that is my homeland. Then I said but Tata what would happen if we met on the Battlefield. He simply replied we would throw are weapons down and give each other a hug. True story THE END.



  98. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    One last thing. While I was on my 1st ,7 month tour In the middle east. The Canadian Army paid for 21 days for me to travel anywhere in Europe. They also paid for my Tata to join me since I could claim my wife or one parent.

    It was easy to decide and I met my Tata in Frakfurt Germany. We made are way down to Hrvatska. He hadn’t been there for 52 years. He enjoyed the vacation until he burnt down the family Barn and was arrested and banished again until 2020.(Long Story)

    Anyway I asked him if he felt a connection to Hrvatska. He responded that he was more angrier now then when he left in 1958. I asked why. He responded its still the same Bullshit, Serb controlled government under the disguise of the Hrvati flag. Then he said that he had been away from his homeland to long and felt more Canadian since he had lived there longer.

    So please don’t fool yourself . Unless your protesting in the streets of Croatia for change,working day to day and fighting wars for Croatia’s independence your not fully Croatian. You can have pride in your heritage and bloodline but that’s it.



  99. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Karlovac

    To come back and burn down the barn after 50 years of Exile, now that is one helluva way to announce his arrival. The local Commie-run govt. was prolly like, “Oh no, not him again!”



  100. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Karlovac74,

    Great story my friend. Your tata isn’t the only one that is disappointed with today’s Croatia. You make some excellent points on one’s identity. Also, its great to see that your dad has acknowledged Canada as his home and identity.

    As much as we bleed the checkers, places like Canada, Australia, and the US have given us diaspora so much.



  101. Cekic says:

    So the question should’ve been, what IS your identity?

    @Karlovac 74
    If you went back to live in Croatia and payed taxes, would you then be Croatian/Canadian or would you still be Canadian/Croatian?



  102. Cekic says:

    “So one day I said to my Tata. If Canada goes to war with Croatia who do I fight for. My Tata replied. That’s easy you were born in Canada so you must represent your homeland. I will fight for Hrvatska since that is my homeland. Then I said but Tata what would happen if we met on the Battlefield. He simply replied we would throw are weapons down and give each other a hug. True story THE END.”

    Would I be wrong in saying, you care more for your dad than your homeland?



  103. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    “what IS your identity” vs “How do you identify yourself”

    big difference? Does it change your answer?

    “you care more for your dad than your homeland?”

    Why would you ask something like that?



  104. Cekic says:

    @Denis
    I believe there’s a difference, Karlovac 74 is suggesting to me that I’m a false Croatian. The guys calling me a liar!
    I can accept that there is better Croatians than me, I cannot however accept being called a liar.

    I asked “would I be wrong in saying” that, put the whole question in next time. I’m trying to find out how Canadian Karlovac 74 is, his dad is Canadian now, so I guess he would have no problems in killing Croatians in the battlefield now!
    That was a pathetic question he asked his dad! His dad’s answer was even worse, his dad said fight for your homeland but not if I’m on the other end!



  105. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Cekic,

    I don’t think Karlovac74 is suggesting that you are a “false Croatian.” He’s stating his opinion on who is truly Croatian in his opinion and who isn’t. I believe that you don’t have to pay taxes and live in Croatia to be considered Croatian. It all depends on who you are.

    I wouldn’t put “who would you fight for” in the equation. Its not a question of allegiance. Its just a question of how you feel about yourself.

    As far as his dad, I thought it was an interesting story and answer.

    We are all on the same team in the end. Some of us are “more croatian” than others which is fine. We’re all brothers.



  106. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    @ Denis Svirčić

    Thx my firend for coming to my aid while I was AFK. Now Cekic is either a shit disturber ie Troll or has misunderstood the context of my posts. OK then Ill play the game.

    (FYI I stayed away from posting for months because I’m not a fan of people who shit talk from a computer. Intelligent conversations or Devils advocate is fine and can be done without insults and mud slinging. When you trash talk from a PC I have zero respect for such antics.)

    @Cekic,

    First thing I never called anyone a liar. Second I said your fooling yourself if you think your full blown Hrvat yet do not live In Croatia. Vacation”s in the summer by Adriatic doesn’t count in my books or to the Hrvati back home.They recognize that we have Croatian blood and are happy to see us remember are roots. Yet at the same time the diaspora that feel entitled that they are on the same playing field pis them off.

    I also stated that having a bond or identity is crucial to every mans existence. I’m proud of my roots and heritage and without that I would be lost.

    Second if I went back to Croatia and paid taxes I would still consider myself Canadian Croatian. Like my Tata said he had been away for to long so thus I would have to be living in Hrvatska for sometime for their to be a change in heart and mind. You have to earn your stripes.

    Third thing ” Cekic says: Would I be wrong in saying, you care more for your dad than your homeland? WoW what a dumb fuck statement. Yes I care for my Tata over my Homeland be it Canada or Croatia. Who wouldn’t care more for family then anything else but God.

    Also What you don’t understand Is my Tata’s point of view, so Ill explain. He cant stand separatists or traitors. He’s always felt that the country you were born in should always comes first and heritage second. Like Slavonac from Canada said in his story about the Serb family that fought for Hrvatska because they were born there.

    That is what all Croatians should strive for instead fighting amongst ourselves. ie Like right now. Also My question to my Father wasn’t stupid since I was 7 years old when I asked. Plus I’m sure he used his Hrvati humor to answer a complicated question from a child.

    Fourth and final response.

    Cekic says:I asked “would I be wrong in saying” that, put the whole question in next time. I’m trying to find out how Canadian Karlovac 74 is, his dad is Canadian now, so I guess he would have no problems in killing Croatians in the battlefield now!
    That was a pathetic question he asked his dad! His dad’s answer was even worse, his dad said fight for your homeland but not if I’m on the other end!

    You seem to be asking a lot of what IF questions. So I’ll play out this final chapter in this game of Retardo Montalban. If I could transport just the 2 of us to a distant planet. I would have no problems killing you on the Battlefield.

    Why you ask? Well I have no clue if your name is Cekic or Chetnik plus I think I would be doing this forum page a favor Now I have a question for you. When you receive my killing blow from my fist smashing your face. Is my fist Canadian or Croatian, Canadian/Croatian, Canadian Karlovac and do you get a tax reciept from the impact. JUGHEAD.



  107. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    @ Croatia vs. Antwerp say:To come back and burn down the barn after 50 years of Exile, now that is one helluva way to announce his arrival. The local Commie-run govt. was prolly like, “Oh no, not him again!”

    Yes your right on all accounts. The Issue was a land dispute between My Tata and his sister. He’s the only son,3rd born, and had 4 sisters. My Tata’s two youngest sisters had paid of the commie courts They were given 10% of the land each. leaving my Tata with 80%.

    My Tata’s second youngest Sister had lived on his land there illegally for 15 years, at the time it was 2003. Her Serb Husband colluded to steal the land from my Tata for years by paying off the courts to change my grandfathers will thus removing My Tata’s 100% ownership.

    When we went there. He tried evicting them and then went to a lawyer in Karlovac. The Lawyer said he would have to spend 50-100 k Canadian to remove them, then he would be able to make me the sole owner.

    At that time in my life I had dreams to move from Canada ,leave the Army and consider living a new life in Croatia. I was feeling a pull to get back to my roots but due to my the bullshit family in Croatia and Legal troubles that my ex caused here in Canada it made that dream impossible.

    Ive heard this happen to many other diaspora over the years and I feel your pain.

    In case Chetnik asks If things did work out and I moved back I still wouldn’t call myself a true Hrvat but a Hrvat in Training lol.



  108. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    One more thing. My fathers mentality was if I cant evict you then I”ll burn it all down so you cant have it either. He was found making his escape at the Zagreb Train station.

    I guess he was to old at the time to use his old escape route from the Yugo army in 1958 LOL.



  109. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Karlovac

    “My fathers mentality was if I cant evict you then I”ll burn it all down so you cant have it either.”

    Yep, that sounds about right. I’m no stranger to that mentality either.

    Same thing happened to me. Ya know they’re scumbags that go around bribing some moran at the “Katastar” and put their names on title to land that’s not theirs? Us in the diaspora are particularly vulnerable as they know where not always around. In my case, they picked the wrong Dude to mess with!

    Luckily for me that land was not developed, because if it was, well, burning down the barn woulda been my “Warm-Up.” Hell, I’d be doing time for arson if it was, lol.

    Now to make a long story short, I retained a law firm and recovered my property. It wasn’t costly since it was an open and shut case.



  110. Croatia vs. Antwerp says:

    @ Ab

    It was undeveloped land. It was some Polje we had outside of town. My ancestors used to farm it. Like I said, people sneak their names on Title in the hopes that a piece of land goes up in value due to some kinda development. Then they try and sell right under your nose.



  111. Cekic says:

    @Cekic
    You said I’m not a true Hrvat, I shouldn’t pretend and I shouldn’t fool myself, and know to top it all off you say you didn’t call me a liar!
    Although you do not say it so many words, it follows by natural sequence from your proposition!

    Last time my family went to Croatia, we found what you would call “full blown” Croatian Jehovah’s witnesses! Would your dad hate “full blown” Croatian traitors, I mean they are apostates?
    So it looks like some full blown Croatians aren’t worth shit! Your dad was once a true “Hrvat” but know he is a true “Canadian,” proving he was never a true “Hrvat!” The truth does not change buddy! He is a chameleon!

    My New Year’s resolution is to stop posting on this site.
    I just can’t handle some of shit people write.



  112. Cekic says:

    @Karlovac 74
    Let’s say a person got married, answered I DO to his wedding vows, when would we find out if this person was fooling himself into believing that he could be a husband, or even worse a father?

    About that killer blow, this is a good question!
    Your killer blow would come from a Croatian fist.



  113. Cekic says:

    @Karlovac 74
    The meaning of the word humor!

    Humor – a comic, absurd, or incongruous quality causing amusement!

    “Also My question to my Father wasn’t stupid since I was 7 years old when I asked. Plus I’m sure he used his Hrvati humor to answer a complicated question from a child.”

    You took your dad’s answer seriously, but you are sure he was using his Croatian humor! I don’t get it!!
    My apoligies for not understanding your comments are a joke.
    I believe you asked your dad your pathetic question when you were 40yrs old. You say you were 7, guess what your dad wasn’t 7 when he answered your question!



  114. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    @ Cekic

    As Im reading your comments I can see your somewhat Intelligent but then it all goes downhill when you start throwing stones and having temper tantrums. You comments are ignorant and hold zero value. If you wish to leave this sight in the New Year because of stupid shit people write well you should proof read your own posts.

    I never attacked anyone on this sight but you attacked me. Now your crying for Argentina but I’m not Madonna and you cant handle the heat.Denis put forth a question and I gave my opinion. If you got panties in knot because I think your not a fully Croatian unless you live in Croatia , well then that’s sad and to bad for you.

    One last thing. I can tell I’m having one way conversation with a moron because you bury yourself with idiot remarks. Example you apologize on one hand and then insult on the other. Well here’s an insult and answer to your stupid question.

    Cekic says: Let’s say a person got married, answered I DO to his wedding vows, when would we find out if this person was fooling himself into believing that he could be a husband, or even worse a father?

    In your case immediately. Gay Marriage is illegal and not condoned in the eyes of GOD. A Man cannot marry another man so I would repent for your sins.You could never be a father because you cant conceive Mr hanky from your anal practices.



  115. Denis Svirčić Denis Svirčić says:

    @Karlovac74 / Cekic

    Some funny stuff from you both. Alright, enough attacking each other. One might be smarter than the other, so what.

    We are all brothers? yes?

    Lets stay united!



  116. Cekic says:

    But his gay bit isn’t even funny, but then I remembered that’s the way him and his dad answer complicated questions, with attempted “humor.” Remember the complicated question he asked his dad when he was “7.”

    Dropping there guns and giving each other a hug, that’s kleenex moment, nothing funny about it.



  117. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    @Denis Svirčić

    Sorry Denis I got sucked in by a vortex. BTW its not about intelligence or who can cut and paste from google the best. Yes we all should get along and be brothers but this is a great example of why Croatia and the world has had so many problems.

    People tend to stir the pot and make outlandish accusations just to cause friction.Anyway it doesn’t matter. When Jesus returns and knocks on my door. I’m sure he wont say HI I’m Jesus the Jew from Bethlehem and then ask whats your background. None of it will matter.



  118. Holy Ghost Karlovac74 says:

    @ Cekic

    Cekic says:

    But his gay bit isn’t even funny.

    Well here’s a true story kids. Gather around the Forum table. The Hammer was a Mild Mannered Troller on the Croatian Sports forum page. He would spend day and night trying to antagonize his fellow bothers.

    One day his Boyfriend The Truth returned home. Earlier that day, The Truth had been bitten by a radioactive Dalmatian. He told the Hammer A.K.A the Hummer he was feeling ill. So the Hammer gave him a blow job. At the point of climax the truth unloaded a radioactive isotope onto the hammers face. This imbued the Hammer with great strength and power thus becoming Captain Crobation. The rumors began to swirl on why the Hammer choose such a name.

    Some say there was draw back to his powers. That if he didn’t masturbate his balls would have nuclear meltdown. So to save Hrvatska he jumps into his Penis mobile(ACE and GARY retired and gave him the keys) and travels at light speed to Spilt. There he frequents the gay club scene to insure the safety of the nation.

    TY Captain for saving us with your sacrifice.



  119. Cekic says:

    @Karlovac 74
    That’s funny, only because I’m now imaging a guy sitting at home with his fatigues on, reading comic books!

    Is the game Call of Duty the battlefield you’ve seen?



  120. Cekic says:

    @Karlovac 74
    You talk about Jesus in one comment, then in attempting to be funny in your pathetic story, you give a gay character that is a figment of your imagination the name The Truth. That’s sad.

    Look because I’m a nice guy, I’ll give you some advice, you should stop playing Call of Duty, I didn’t know it was possible but it looks like you can get PTSD playing a game, you’re all over the place moron.



  121. Cekic says:

    Gilbert Keith Chesterton quote

    “A man does not know what he is saying until he knows what he is not saying.”

    You see Karlovac 74, you attacked me and my parents for raising me the way they did. I read what you didn’t say!



  122. Cekic says:

    That’s very good Bob.

    Poglavnik is still crying because I exposed him as a traitor, a turn coat, an apostate and a condemner of his own ancestors.
    Poglavnik is in fact a parasite. I feel sorry for his family because Poglavnik has become a stumbling block in their way.

    Now the idiot won’t even understand what I wrote, but the moron will respond.



  123. Cekic says:

    I’m not wrong about that apostate. You’ve said that to me before parasite.
    If you think that I learnt the word cekic from Slavonac, you’re wrong about that you apostate parasite.
    I discovered this site in June, if you go through my comments (that’s a good idea for you, you might learn something you dopey bastard) you’ll find out that I knew the word before Slavonac told me.



  124. Poglavnik says:

    Cekic is holier than though and the ultimate Hrvat.
    That’s what this insecure idiot wants us to believe, yet 6 months ago he didn’t even know that a hammer is a cekic.
    The ultimate Hrvati has a Croatian vocabulary that rivals my 5 year old Canadian nieces..



  125. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik/Robert the Builder
    You’re building a reputation as a douche bag!
    You username going forward should be Bob the Builder.
    Please don’t bother me anymore, I feel stupid exchanging comments with ya.

    You are a traitor, a turn coat, an apostate and a condemner of your own ancestors, try argue that Bobby.



  126. Poglavnik says:

    What does your good book say about being an agitating little shit?
    Did your religious upbringing teach you to be the Internet tough guy that you are?
    Go away loser!
    Back to your mom’s basement kid!



  127. Poglavnik says:

    You’re way worse of a religious example than I am.
    I don’t live my life like a walking contradiction.
    You claim to be some great Catholic yet you run your mouth on this site day and night.
    Your a class act kid!
    God’s really proud of you.



  128. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik
    I believe in God, you believe in science.
    How is it even possible that I’m a worse example than you?
    You’re a stumbling block to your family, I hope you don’t convert your family to your beliefs. If you want to go to Hell, go, but please leave your family alone, they’re Catholic like me! You’re a parasite!



  129. Anonymous says:

    @Poglavnik
    I was talking with Sude Mi once, and you decided to chime in and make fun of me because I was religious, but you didn’t realise that Sude Mi was Catholic also, that’s when you outed yourself as a traitor, turncoat, apostate and condemner of your own ancestors! Don’t be angry with me now Bob!
    You should really drop the Poglavnik name moron.
    Bob the Builder is the name for you!



  130. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik
    How do feel to find out that you agitated me first you little shit.
    Sude Mi didn’t need your help, Karlovac 74 didn’t need your help, in fact you are irrelevant!

    I will fulfill my New Years resolution, but know this, you are the dumbest piece of crap on this site, you know what you are, I don’t need to write again.



  131. Poglavnik says:

    Youre an insult to any god fearing man, kid.
    U don’t embody anything about a humble religious lifestyle.
    Keep running your mouth and picking fights with people here.
    Your god is really proud of you!
    You’re easily one of the least Croatian people I’ve come across on this site.



  132. Cekic says:

    @Poglavnik
    I am not offended by you saying I am the least Croatian on this site, now Karlovac 74 is right, in the end background won’t matter!

    “Anyway it doesn’t matter. When Jesus returns and knocks on my door. I’m sure he wont say HI I’m Jesus the Jew from Bethlehem and then ask whats your background. None of it will matter.” – Karlovac 74

    Now you’re saying I’m not humble when pride is the reason you’re not Catholic anymore! Talking about god fearing men, when you don’t even believe in God! Is there an end to your stupidity? 6 months on this site, you’re the only person whose never said anything intelligent.



  133. Zadar97 says:

    All you fools need to shut up and stop shit talking each other do you think the jews do this on their social media,NO they help each other out in any way they possibly can. Thats the problem with SOME of you Croatians you all have such big EGO’s. Lets fucking talk about how we can unite with one another and make the diaspora around the world stronger. We should be networking with one another, for example helping unemployed Croatians in North America find work from a Croatian who my own a business or be in a position to hire someone. That sorta thing is what we should be doing online not attacking fellow fucking Croatians. For all you guys know someone in your family coulda been fighting for Croatia’s freedom along side or in the same group as the person your arguing/attacking in the comments, and this isn’t the whole comment section I have seen this sorta stuff go on, I have read dozens of posts all over the internet mostly on Facebook about fellow Cro’s attacking each other about stuff that should be kept in their heads. BTW I am on 18 years old and some of you are probably much older than me but I know better, that all this nonsense should not be happening btwn one another somewhere in the world your dead relatives are rolling over in their graves.



  134. Catholic first says:

    John 15:4
    Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abide in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me.

    Ephesians 4:3
    Careful to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

    Jude 1:19
    These are they, who separate themselves, sensual men, having not the Spirit.

    All Catholic Croats should be wary of the non-Catholic Croat who attaches himself to us under the common name of Croatian. Remember, the Catholic Church is the Body of Christ, he who separates himself from this Body has not the Spirit even though he be Croatian.

    Zadar97, you’re still learning young fella, but I will admit that you are smarter than I was at 18.

    “If you believe the purpose of life is to serve yourself, then your life has no purpose. Help someone today.”
    – Paul Blart





Your email address will not be published.